And I know this is a big ask, because of the length of these videos, but after you are finished with the first video I posted, I recommend taking the time and watching this one as well.
Thanks DP. I will definitely watch these on the late night tonight when I have some free time to watch and focus.
I read a book a few years ago. It was called "Sapiens". It's a great read. It's basically the history of the homosapiens, and every species that led up to what we are now, dating back 300,000,000 years. And the entire book is evidence and fact based.
So, as a kid in the 1980s and stuff, the common theme you would hear in the Catholic circles was that one cannot believe in evolution and jesus/bible as well.
So, if you take the bible at it's word, verbatim, it states that god created the universe in 6 days, at which time, he created man...
Now, taken literally, that makes it impossible to believe in both.....
So, after reading the book I mentioned and just listening to science, at this point, I find it hard to believe that evolution is not a thing. The skeletal remains are there. We have carbon dated it. We have seen the cross breeding between sapiens and neanderthals and everything. Most of you have all done 23 and me or whatever, so you do all know that we "as humans" originate in what is now Africa. It is CLEAR that different "races" as it were, developed their traits and characteristics over 10s of thousands of years, based on sun and geographic location....
So, long story short, I believe in both. And in modern times, many Christians feel the same way. Theistic evolution or evolutionary creation.
In a nutshell, evolutionary creationism basically means that god created all life, and evolution is the science involved in what god used as development for human beings. When we, as a species made it to the point where we were "in his image" as it were, that is when he intervened and this is when he sent his son to our world.....
So, basically, I am just saying that I have read/learned/studied enough on this in the past couple of decades that I can be at peace with both ideas. To me, our evolution is a fact. That can also be true about the bible.
What is a million years to us, may be just the blink of an eye for god.
That is the basic idea behind it, rather than fighting for centuries the idea that before what we call man now, was a slightly different itteration that took millions of years to get where it was.
I personally don't believe in evolution per say, we were made in God's image. Not something else that eventually became what we are today. I actually think it's the opposite, we are far lesser beings than God initially created us to be, and have degraded through time. Adam and Eve were created to live forever, Eve blew it for all us. Then God started reducing human's life span as he saw the evil we had become, and now look at us, can barely make it beyond 60's most of us, 90 if you're really lucky, 100 plus is rare but exists.
There is a debate on whether or not 1 day is equal to one sun down then one sun up, or if 1 day for God = 1,000 years for humans, there are some scripture references for that, but what I think should be pointed out is that God doesn't operate within the constraints of time, as we know it.
@dawnpatrol321 Yeah, I operated under that notion for quite a while. Also to note, I was skeptical about even reading that book "Sapiens" because I didn't want to go digging for any kind of "opposing truth"... But I read it anyway. And my beliefs are not just because of this book. This was simply a recent catalyst for me thinking about the entire topic, stripping it down and thinking: Okay, what if?
So, I guess that is the cross roads that I face in my mind. Back in the 80s and 90s, the answer was simple: "Evolution is not a thing. We did NOT come from monkeys"... And while the "monkey thing" might not be true, I have yet to find ANY evidence that would dispute the physical evidence left behind for millions of years, that clearly shows the development and "evolution" if you will, of what modern day humans are....
So, from an "Evolution doesn't exist" stand point... I just don't know how to rationalize that in my own mind. I guess you could say that "10,000 years ago, god created 'Man' as we know it.... Everything leading up to that point was just "development of life on earth"... The air. The oceans. The plants. The animals.... So one could surmise that once earth had become the developed environment, this is when god intervened and gave us "humanity"..... Or whatever we look like today...
Now, that by itself could be a reasonable enough conclusion. But what that DOESN'T answer, is this: The earth has been around for hundreds of millions of years. This is a fact. The bible nor the church can dispute that in any way. There is no way around it. That is like someone trying to tell me the earth is flat. It just isn't....
So, with the absence of evolution as we know it, what is the explanation for those hundreds of millions of years? The Australopithecus, the Homo Habilis, the Homo Erectus, Neanderthals, and eventually homo sapiens....
The reason I ask is because we have full fossils, tons of them that have been studied, carbon dated and pretty much verified....
So, that is where my questions hit a brick wall.... Okay, god create earth. God created "man".... So with the absence of evolution, where did we come from? Was the first day of man when the first "homo sapiens" were on earth? And were those two homo sapiens Adam and Eve? Possibly? But that would mean, at that time, there were millions of "homo erectus" or neanderthals still walking the earth.....
So, those are some answers that I lack. Even on just a theoretical level....
Now, I can also get on board with the "time thing".... As we all know, the new testament claims that average ages were 900 years and what not. It kicks the whole book off breaking all that down....
So, does that mean that they were really 900 years old? Maybe. Maybe not. Maybe in those times, a "year" was really what we consider 30 days or some other time frame. Who knows...
And yes, 1 day for god could have been 500,000 years in human time... Yes, that could absolutely be the case.
But none of that explains why during that 3 million year time frame, there were millions of other "human like species" walking the earth....
So, what do we consider that period of time? The earth was here for millions and millions of years before homo sapiens ever were.
So, I guess a fundamental question is this: What is man? Is "man" a homo sapien, or were Neaderthals considered "man" by today's standards....
So, if neanderthals were not "man", and that designation only hold true to homo sapiens, then I am okay with that, and that puts Adam and Eve as the first Sapiens, and the time lines of the bible would coincide with that....
But it still leaves the remaining question: What do we consider those hundreds of millions of years that went by from when the earth was created, and what we are now...
And there is no exact answer to this: The number is way larger than I imagine. One could easily say "I trust god over science" and fundamentally, that is how I am. But I still ask questions and I still need to be convinced about certain things. But at any rate, modern scientists put the age of the earth between 4-5 BILLION years old....
Billions.... So, I guess I mispoke and underquoted above.... What do we call the 4 BILLION years from where the earth, it's plants and it's animals have been created, and what we are now....
Even tracing back to the earliest lineage connected to humans, those species are first dated back 7 million years ago....
So, even if you remove the 4 billion years from earth, where there were no human like species AT ALL walking around on 2 legs, that still leaves 7 million years of unaccounted time. So, were Adam and eve Homo-Erectus? And in modern times, we draw them to look like us?
And all of these questions lead me back to the logical theological conclusion, where all of these things can be true at the same time...
God creates earth. Gives us all that we need. 4 BILLION years go by. In his eyes, that is a matter of days or whatever.... The plants are developing. Those Dinosaurs things god made didn't work out either.... But FINALLY, about 10,000 years ago, we finally made it to where he wanted us to. We finally "evolved" into what his world needed us to be. We have the right figures. Brains. Extremities. Statures....
So, you could pin point that the first "homo-sapiens" were Adam and Eve, 10,000ish years ago..... And that was the beginning.... And a few thousand years later, when we had already become pieces of shit, god said, damn, that wasn't the one. So he spoke to Noah, built the Ark and flooded the world, thus starting over.....
So, that is the logical, rational version of how I could understand all that being true....
But when I look at is from the: Earth was created along with "man/homo sapiens" at the same time, I just can't believe that fully. There is too much scientific evidence out there to combat that view point. And yes, "Man knows nothing. God knows all".... But what I will remind you, is that everything I am saying now, and much smarter people than me have studied for thousands of years are the ones that come up with all these ideas and spread them to us.... People have read the bible for thousands of years, and these are the perspective they gathered from it. Mostly taken absolutely literally, thousands of years went by and it was law that "Earth and Man came on the same 6 days" or whatever. But that could simply be modern man's interpretation of it all. It's not like god wrote any of this himself. This is all words from flawed, sinning humans". So even with the best intentions, I would have to hear it from god's mouth to my ears for any of that to make sense...
DP: I had a little bit of a shit show late last night at home with kids stuff and what not, so I wasn't able to watch those videos. I am gonna take a crack at it again tonight. That stuff interests me.... I love reading about faith and science and how the two can go hand in hand. It's actually a strengthening to my faith in a lot of ways....
So, just tossing my own internal questions out there... That is all.
@zach619 You might find this ties it all together for you. This is 16 minutes, someone much more qualified than me, a Christian and Scientist breaks down Genesis and can illustrate what I think you're trying to say, more or less, but may have some caveats, like the difference between the neanderthal and humans.
3 Minute follow up clip.
DP, good shit. Yes, that scientist explained exactly what I was trying to say, but in proper scientific terms. He has obviously dedicated his time and life to this, so his explanation is much more eloquent.
So yes, that is what I was saying. The earth is 5 Billion years old. Scientist dude also agrees. There were Dinosaurs. There were neanderthals.
But that was my question: Was a neanderthal a man? I guess the answer is no, because they lacked spirituality.
So, why did he create those species, along with dinosaurs, if the ultimate goal was never to have them develop into man? Not sure. Not sure why that would have happened, or what the intention was.
But aside from that, that really kinda of piggy backs on my takes from this. What I explained a few hours ago above, was not some take that I took from a certain person. That was the explanation I have pieced together over time, weighing the data and facts behind science, while considering what is spoken in the bible.
Like I said, it doesn't have to be one or the other. It can be both.
And I think it's a great point that he re-itterates that what we consider "A Day" is not at all what that means in the biblical context.
Also, his explanation that "days" were actually hundreds of thousands, if not millions of years at a time, means that 10,000 years ago, "day 7" began, so by his previous standards, the 7th day could stretch for another million years by that rationale.
I had never heard, or remember hearing someone say "We are still in the 7th day"...
And that statement alone, leaves all of the doors wide open and connects quite a few un-answered "dots" that I often try and connect...
Great video. Nice to know I am not the only asshole out there questions what was up with Dinosaurs, and what the purpose for millions of years of evolution was, if all those previous species were to be wiped out and in steps "man".....
And again, this is deeper, but I logically believe that with the atmosphere and development of the earth, I think that God certainly could have created the initial living upright "human like creature" and let it develop and become accustomed to the atmosphere and plants and what not.... And finally, when it got to the point of development, we were on the brink of the home-sapien, he simply said. Okay, Day 6 is over. This is exactly where I wanted "man to be, in my image". It's go time....
And maybe the Dinosaurs were an integral part in the development of the atmosphere and vegitation for man at a later date. Who knows.
I also thinks is SUPER interesting that he points out that: Yes, plants DID come before land creatures, even though scientists for over a century argued against that. And the only fossils that we have are fully developed, 2 meter long fossils and what not. We have never collected fossils or data points of these early species in their infancy.
Like the Dr. said. These animals didn't develop over time from cells. One day, there were only plants. No animals. The next day, BOOM, we have thousands of animals, in full sizes, multipl meters in length. With nothing in between. From nothing to everything in the blink of an eye....
Interesting stuff. Thanks for sharing DP. Got my mind going for sure.
@zach619 Glad you found it useful. If you really want to geek out on this stuff, I think you'll find Wesley Huff very helpful as well. He's forgotten more about this stuff than I'll probably ever learn, but I am trying to get caught up best I can.
Hey Zach, this video is a condensed explanation of the Shroud of Turin. It cuts through all the back and forth discussion and hits on all the points he was trying to explain in the longform podcast and has a little better imagery than they were able to show. 21 minutes. Pretty amazing stuff.
Kinda controversial situation whereas a surfer got hit by a driver, assuming after they lost control of their vehicle. Now the surfer (likely his parents/legal team) is trying to sue the state for not providing adequate parking to this surf spot. Some are quick to call it a moneygrab suit. I don't know the ins and outs of this spot in general, but there are plenty of surf spots whereas you just pull off the shoulder of the road. Would be sorta interesting to see if anything is made of it
on a side note, what's with 2nd light in Melbourne, FL? From the brief post i saw, they removed the traffic light there. But did they bulldoze the parking area or sumtin? It was kind of a farewell message/post. It's one of those surf gems in the space coast to those who don't know
@unfurled Are you talking about 2nd Light on Patrick's Space Force Base? Theres been some construction going on at the base, and also across the street beachside where they are building a few buildings on the North end of the base, probably putting in a beach access and everything.
@dawnpatrol321 yup, that's the only 2nd light spot i know about. Saw some post saying RIP. Maybe they're thinking it's going to f up the sandbars or sumtin...Didn't read too much into it
@unfurled Not sure why it would do anything to the sandbars unless they're doing some dredging or sand replenishment or something, all I have seen so far has nothing to do with the beach itself. If you have a link to where you saw this please post. I don't hit 2nd light that often but I do hit it from time to time. It's not the most reliable honestly, but when it's good it's good. I consider 2nd light South CCB, so when you said Melbourne that threw me off, that's why I asked lol, Melbourne Beach is a bit South of there, but I got you. There is a flashing light down in S. Melbourne Beach that it may have been, but not a "2nd" light 😎 .
Found it. Tried to screenshot. In Central Florida Surfing page on FB, captioned with pic of 2nd Light Beach stand, "A moment of silence for all who got to enjoy the legendary surf spot back in the day. As the last traffic light utility pole disappears. 2nd Light becomes nothing more but a myth in our surfing culture."
so maybe i guess they just took out the traffic light and nothing else. Not sure how it got in my algorythm, i don't follow Central Florida surfing. Maybe it's all those Gnarly Charley postings and i've taken too much time to see what the hell he's got to say on upcoming 'canes...
@unfurled HAHA, these guys, I guess they really need a traffic light for it to be a "legendary" spot? Can't call it "2nd light" without the traffic light directly next to the parking lot to the beach lol. I bet most people bemoaning it probably surf it 1 time per year.
Honestly, all they did was move the gate to enter / exit the base on the opposite side of the road, just a little North across from O Club / Blockhouse Beach, which you can literally walk to in about 100 yards. It's pretty much the same thing to me, not like they got rid of the parking lot to surf "2nd light", it's still an access, "but what will they call it?" One may ask? Oh the humanity! 😎
them boys got served for life, fyi
curious of how much lost biz (surf travel) because of the ambush
Seems like this story is old in surf news, considering all the talk of the rape allegations in Tahiti. Seen some back and forth on that, but nothing mainstream media that i know about. Again, another bad story involving Mexico nevertheless
wierd one out of Melbourne, FL:
@oipaul Wow that's really close to home, literally. Prayers for family of Hunter, may he RIP. Regardless of what he may or may not have been doing, it's tragic. And Patel is a murderer, period.